martha: bye everybody, "happening now" starts right now. jon: fox news alert. we're waiting to hear any moment now from the speaker of the house. john boehner will hold a news conference in front of the fashion you see there to announce what the house intend to do. they have just held a members-only meeting, not even staff allowed. staffers were kicked out of this membership meeting among the house republicans to talk about what they're going to do with regard to the government shutdown and the budget deficit, i'm sorry, the budget ceiling. that it is due to expire or reach this week. when the speaker heads to the microphones there, any minute now as i said, you will hear it here first on fox. we're told that house republicans are feeling pretty positive about the plan they come up with. they say it is very similar to the senate plan. that could mean an end to all of this, these goings on in washington we've been talking about more than two weeks now. jenna: photographers are ready to go. they're watching in d.c. we'll

bring to you a different site in los angeles where we're watching a transformer fire in wilmington, california, just outside of l.a. this is a huge shipyard. a lot of business being done here. firefighters are on the scene. we're not quite sure what caused the fire. we know it's a transformer fire. that might be a little self-explanatory, jon, right? we don't know exactly the conditions surrounding it or what is burning close to it at this time. as we hear more we'll bring you back to l.a. something we're watching out in california a transformer fire at a shipyard. right now brand new stories and breaking news. jon: we're learning more about president bush's heart condition back in august. turns out it was a lot more serious than we first thought. two girls are under arrest now after the death of a 12-year-old in florida. authorities say the 12-year-old committed suicide after being bullied online for nearly a year dramatic dash-cam video captures the moment a car gets

smashed by a freight train as a driver tries to get away from police. it is all "happening now." jenna: back to our top story. speaker boehner washington, d.c. let's go live to the conference now. oh, looks like we got faulty reporting. well -- jon: we know he, he is on the way, we know. but here's what has been happening. house republican caucus has been meeting very much in private. they kicked out even senior staffers which is fairly unusual. clearly they wanted to talk amongst themselves and not have any other ears listening. jenna: certainly there is a lot of anonymous sources, aides quoted, unnamed aides that have been part of this story over last several weeks. considering tensions and also a lot of anxiety about geting a deal done by thursday when treasury secretary jack lew says that is really the point we need to get a deal done so we don't

have any sort of risk of defaulting on our debt. maybe this is part of the strategy, jon, to bring top leaders together to figure it out. we were waiting as bill and martha about 90 minutes. i was told my ear that boehner is stepping to the microphone. we're all a little anxious to hear what the details actually are. jon: as we await the speaker of the house we'll keep the camera trained on that podium. let's bring into the mix, david drucker, "washington examiner" senior correspondent. david, the house members are saying they are fairly positive they have a deal that's very close to what the senate has already done. that suggests that the two houses are going to be able to come together. what can you tell us about it? >> well, what we know that the house plan looks very similar to the senate plan. basically the foundation is the same. just that house republicans, if they can get the votes for this thing and it is unclear how many democrats would join them. we don't know if it will need

217 republican votes or not. if they could get the votes it would delay medical device tax by two years which republicans and a lot of democrats actually have been after. jon: that is part of obamacare. >> that is part of obamacare. it would also add the vitter language as we've been calling it. basically it would say that members of congress the president, vice president, and his cabinet have to participate in obamacare without any employer contribution or subsidy but it would not include staff. neither congressional staff or executive branch staff. and there are a few other things in there that house republicans would add in. so the key question here is, can they pass this? the plan is to vote on it today at some time. and, the plan would reopen the government. it would raise the debt ceiling. it would follow the dates as prescribed by the senate compromise that we've been discussing. but can they do it? that is a big question. sources are telling us that they're not necessarily really whipping this. in other words, trying to arm-twist or secure 217

republican votes before they put it on the floor. they're simply going to put it on the floor and try to prevent themselves from being jammed by the senate. a lost house republicans were concerned they would have to eat whatever the senate sent over. a big motivation here is to try to prevent that from happening and have some influence in the final product. jon: you say can they pass it? staffers have suggested that they think this, members of congress have suggested that they think the vote would be close in the house, meaning there is not exactly uniform appeal for what is being concocted here. there is also another question. would the president sign this legislation. as you were speaking, david, we bottom this bulletin from reuters out of the white house, that, suggests the white house is not too happy. the white house says latest fiscal proposal from house republican, is, quote, partisan attempt to appease a small group of tea party republicans. that is the bulletin from

reuters. how do you read that, david? what does that mean about what the white house is thinking about all of this? >> well i think that could be interpreted as a signal to house democrats not to help republicans pass this. however until i see a an actual veto threat from the white house i'm not going to discount the idea this might be able to work. don't forget it is taking the senate compromise and adding a couple things that were part of the senate discussions to begin with, including the medical device tax. in my mind the biggest thing the administration might have a problem with, a part of this plan would prevent, if the administration followed this, prevent the administration using extraordinary measures to delay the debt ceiling after february 7th, which is when the debt ceiling would have to be raised again according to both the senate plan and this plan. the big question is, can republicans pass this in the house? if they can it will put senate

democrats under some pressure and i think senate republicans will support the plan and i don't think the president will want to dump it outright as we're so close to the debt ceiling. jon: what would the president find in this plan that is so unappealing? he says he doesn't want changes in the obamacare, the delay in this medical device tax, in two years is that so absolutely unappealing to him that he would veto the legislation or is it something else? >> i think it might just be all parties, senate democrats, house republicans and the administration trying to squeeze out a win here of some sort and not wanting to let the message be sent that you were able to do everything you were able to do, whether it is the president or house republicans or senate democrats and get away with extracting particular concessions. what we do knee is that senate republicans and senate democrats have been negotiating with the approval of the white house. it has been kept informed. so negotiations are happening. the white house approves of

those negotiations. i think the white house would prefer an outcome in effect visually optically freezes out house republicans and leaves them with the shortened of the stick. the question for house republicans, if you don't want that to happen can you get together today to pass something politically strategic, that gives you a chance to outflank the senate? this might be the thing that does that. if this happens fast enough, the senate could also make a final adjustment and ping it back to the house. that is a possibility. we have a few more steps here before we get to the end. jon: it just seems like for all of the arguing over these last 15 days and really even before that, that they do have some legislation or potential legislation here that's pretty close to what, you know, what makes all parties happy and it seems to me that the white house would be reluctant to veto something like this, if in fact as you say, if the house can vote in the affirmative?

>> i think you're right. and so i can see a scenario where the white house tries to send a signal to house democrats. don't help republicans pass this. but if they can actually put together 217 republican votes or enough votes with a combination of republicans and democrats to actually pass this bill, then i think the white house probably given the timing and possibly with some changes from the democratic senate, would swallow this, would go along with this. there are other things in there that the white house likes potentially. one is, a reinsurance fee that would be delayed. we know house republicans want to get rid of it. i could see senate democrats putting it back in. there are still things that can be done here. i don't think anybody will outright dismiss something that can pass at this point. jon: let me read something from amy bran digit, a white house -- bran digit, official language from the white house. the president said repeatedly

members of congress don't get to extract ransom for passing a budget and paying the nation's bills. unfortunately the latest proposal from house republicans does just that in partisan attempt to appease a small group of tea party republican who is forced the government shutdown in the first place. and again, you know, david, there are a lot of people a lot of democrats, both in the house and senate who don't like that medical device tax. they appear to, in this individualer language -- vitter language, appear to be compromising forcing members of congress and senators and the senate to live under the terms of obamacare. here we have the speaker of the house. let's hear what he has to say. >> good morning, everyone. our leadership team met with our members today trying to find a way forward in a bipartisan way that would continue to provide fairness to the american people under obamacare.

there are a lot of opinions about what direction to go. there have been no decisions about what exactly we will do. but we're going to continue to work with our members on both sides of the aisle to try to make sure that there's no issue of default and to get our government reopened. >> good morning. we just talked to our members. i think it has been very clear all along what we as republicans in the house wanted. one we wanted the democrat to sit down and talk to us so we can work out our differences. we've been saying since day one there should be no special treatment under the law and should be fairness for all americans, those elected and those unelected. i'm glad to see that harry reid in the senate finally has begun to sit down and talk with the republican leader there and we encourage that. we also though, as the house republican conference think it's very, very important for to us stress in whatever proposal we

move forward, will reflect our position on fairness. that no special treatment for anybody under the law. >> it is very clear in our discussions that we think individuals should be treated fairly. that big business should not have special treatment. members of congress should not have special treatment. we are very cognizant of the calendar. we want to find a solution in a bipartisan man they're gets us moving forward and gets america back working again. >> for weeks now the republicans in the house have been leading with solutions and we believe this is the time for solutions and they need to be based upon fairness for all. we recognize that people all across this country continue to struggle and have their challenges. as the foundation we want to insure that laws are written and implemented in a way that provides fairness for all, whether it is mom, dads, small business owners, seniors, young people that try to find their

way forward. we, in the house, remain committed to being a part of a solution to working in a bipartisan fashion to find those common sense ways to make sure we're doing what is good and right for america. >> i will take a couple of questions. >> mr. speaker, the changes in your bill to the president's health care law are arguably pretty minor. were they worth a two-week government shutdown? >> we're working with our members on a way forward to make sure we provide fairness to the american people. >> do you guaranty the american people, congress will not pass the deadline and push us into default. >> listen i made clear for months and months that the idea of default is wrong and we shouldn't get anywhere close to it. >> last question. >> mr. speaker, will there be a vote today on the plan? >> -- plan that would make it -- [inaudible] >> we're talking with our members on both sides of the aisle to try to find a way to move forward today.

thanks. jon: so there you heard it from the speaker of the house and the republican leadership team in the house. they are hoping that this deal goes forward but obviously they didn't want to get into a lot of the nuts and bolts of the legislation as proposed. meantime the president apparently plans to do a little bit of arm-twisting himself. the white house is announcing that at about 3:00 this afternoon, the president is going to meet with the democratic leadership team, 3:15 eastern time today. they will talk about what has been going on, the government shutdown and so forth. let's go back once again to david drucker from the "washington examiner", the senior correspondent there. so just give us some sense of how this works. the speaker of the house, republican, comes out with his team and says this. the white house is clearly trying to pressure the republican side.

they will have their own meeting with the democratic leadership. what do you suppose, read the tea leafs for us, david. what is this about? >> the first thing that was interesting the speaker did not announce the vote is definitely going to occur. he is still consulting with members. that tells me they don't necessarily feel like they have the votes to move this across the finish line. whether a combination of republican or democratic votes or just republican votes. it may mean that he doesn't want to put something on the floor that he doesn't know for a fact will actually pass. i think that is point one. i think point two, i took away from that that he is trying to sound conciliatory and bipartisan. we're close to the debt ceiling. it is two day as way. he wants this to be read as republicans trying to find a solution. clearly a solution with their stamp on it but a solution nonetheless and i think what we need to see has any of the movement in the house today influenced the senate negotiations between mitch mcconnell and harry reid? those negotiations is what got

us to this point and the feeling there is a way out of this in time and so it will be interesting to see how house republicans attempting to stake out a position has influence, if at all either way, with what is happening in the senate and how the president of course feels about everything because if he wants to he can issue a veto threat. jon: after all the acrimony over last couple weeks and even before that, mitch mcconnell and harry reid are talking to each other like friends today, so it would sound. >> it is a big reason why this is getting somewhere if it does. jon: david drucker from the "washington examiner", thank you. >> thanks a lot. jenna: while that is happening on capitol hill the world war ii memorial is becoming the scene for veterans protesting the government shutdown. dozens of military organizations are gathering to send an even louder message. doug mckelway is live at the world war ii memorial in washington with more. doug? >> reporter: hi, jenna. i will take note and step out of camera. a couple more honor flights in

past couple minutes arrived at world war ii memorial. these are world war ii vets. one group came in from texas a few moments ago. these are the guys who quite literally fought for our freedom and they will be dammed if they can not showt world war ii veterans and express their sentiments and gain access to the memorial which remains out of bounds. nevertheless the protest we're seeing here today at a press conference is very much different from the up with we saw on monday where we had veterans quite literally picking up barricades which some derisively referred to as barr-cades or barack-cades removed them and stacked them up at memorials all up and down the mall. so were placed directly in front of the white house gate. this in contrast is a organized press conference put together by 33 different veterans organizations this. is largely apolitical. they're here to express the

sentiment it that they're sick and tired of the political gamesmanship and finger pointing in washington which they see as basically juvenile, one-upsmanship, whether it be in congress or in the white house. they say if this shutdown continues over the next couple of weeks, 5.5 million veterans and their families are going to be adversely affected. listen to what some had to say this morning. >> millions of men and women who are transitioning or already transitioned from military service will be forced to depend upon charity. >> unless the stalemate is resolved by the end of october, 4 million members may not receive disability compensation, pension or gib payments. >> reporter: there are a lot of concerns as well about military readiness. there is a ma green group here, marine reserve group. as we know the u.s. military heavily depends on reserve units right now. they are unable to train even though they're scheduled to deploy to afghanistan in 2014.

they say they are just not ready for that in large part due to the government shutdown. this is more peaceful and calm demonstration than we saw on sunday. we have honor flights coming throughout the day and ordinary pedestrians coming in. they're, we're standing right by a barrier as you can see. they have been reerected since sunday's protest but people are walking right around them, doug. jenna: thank you, doug. as news warrants. we'll walk back to you. that is important side of the story we continue to watch. we heard from speaker boehner moments ago potentially a new plan put together by house republicans. we're now learning we'll get leadership from the democrats in about 10 minutes. hopefully some more news. maybe some sort of a response. boehner didn't say much. it will be interesting what sort of details democrats have to respond to before they have a meeting at white house a little before 3:00 today. jon: gamesmanship goes on. meantime an incredible scene caught on tape. bolts of lightning hit the water

as two young fishermen try to get to safety. we'll tell you their story straight ahead. as you can see from our coverage, the media has been keeping a close eye on washington with the government shutdown as we approach the debt ceiling deadline. we'll talk about whether journalists have been getting the coverage right. [woman]ask me... [announcer]...if you think the best bed for one of you might be a compromise for the other one... [woman]ask me about our tempur-pedic. [announcer] they're sleeping on the newest tempur-pedic bed... the new tempur choice... [man]two people.two remotes. [announcer] firmness settings for the head,legs,and back... and with tempur on top,that famous tempur-pedic comfort comes any way you like it! [woman]ask me about the lumbar button. [man]she's got her side...and i've got my side. [announcer] tempur-pedic.the most highly recommended bed in america. [woman]don't touch my side!

jon: back to capitol hill where both the house and senate are now proposing solutions just two days best debt ceiling deadline with the government partially shut down for the 15th day. the media has been covering it all. has the coverage been fair? joining us a long-time journal ist, cal thomas,

syndicated columnist and fox news contributor. what do you think so far, cal? >> jon, the incendiary rhetoric being uses amaze as veteran journalist like me. we're hearing phrases from brian todd of cnn and bob schieffer of cbs news and jihad and explosive vest and suicide caucus. this is ridiculous. the other thing we're hearing once a law is passed by democrats it has equivalent of eternal life. bob schieffer suggested that on "face the nation" on sunday. jon: talking about referring to obamacare and the fact that republicans were so upset about it and the answer from the other side, it is settled law? >> that's right. if that were the premise, then we would still have prohibition. you wouldn't get a alcoholic drink at a bar. we would still have separate but equal. we might even have slavery. african-americans would be using separate water fountains and different restrooms. this idea if a liberal pass as law, liberal president signs it

should go on forever and not be changed is ludicrous but this is the way the media is covering this, making the tea party people, conservative and principled republicans the enemies of the united states. jon: let me play for you just a clip of the sound from the speaker of the house's news conference just from now, the first question out of the box i thought was kind of interesting. let's play that, get your reaction. >> mr. speaker, the changes in your bill to the president's health care law are arguably pretty minor. were they worth a two-week government shutdown? >> we're working with our members on a a way forward to make sure we provide fairness to the american people. jon: the question if you weren't able to hear it, she basically said the changes being proposed to the president's health care law are quite mon nor. was it worth of two-week shutdown of the government which is now in its 15th day? well, you're reaction to that question first of all? >> there is presumption in all questions. this is going on not just for weeks but every time republicans

control any branch of government. how can you stand in the way of democrats? democrats are noble and rid schuss. you only want to do good things for people and mean-spirited jihadist republicans are racist, sexist, homophobes that is another underlying theme stand in way of progress for america. let me give you example reporter commentator on many years. how the reporting goes on other side. this is cal thomasings in washington where principled republicans are standing against efforts by liberal democrats to spend this nation into owe live i don't know and go outside the constitutional bound for the government. that is the flipside how that reporting would go, jon. jon: you've written a book, part of the title is how, how to stop the partisan war destroying america. both parties are guilty of some of this, aren't they? >> they are of course. bob beckel and i wrote this book together. we have another column coming up thursday in "usa today." i think one of the breakdown problems in washington is that nobody knows

each other anymore. we're all defined by labels, left and right, republican, democrat and nobody takes the time to build personal relationships. that is one of the destructive things i've seen in my years in journalism in this town. people don't take time to get to know each other. they get on tv they repeat the same old sound bites we have heard over and over again and nothing gets accomplished and the reason for that is the various interest groups who supply the money to both sides want it one way and one way only. compromise now is viewed as the language of the devil and if you compromise you can even be called the devil. >> the president said he wouldn't compromise on any of this legislation. >> you know the president of course when he was in the senate said that voting to raise the debt ceiling which he voted against when he was a senator is an indication of failure of leadership. what is it now that he is in charge? is it a failure of his leadership because he wants the debt limit raised? we don't see these clips played

on major networks and major newspapers have totally forgotten them. jon: cal thomas, syndicated columnist, fox news contributor. good to have you on, cal. >> thank you, jon. good to see. >> just a few minutes away from the house democratic leadership stepping back to the microphones. we'll bring you back to d.c. when that happens. if you thought the health care website glitches was over, you can see this home screen, might want to think again. the latest on what the white house is doing about all the problems plaguing the health care site. iran is asking permission for making nuclear materials as part of a deal with the west. is this a nonstarter or something to consider? a closer look at talks happening right now with iran next. when we made our commitment to the gulf, bp had two big goals:

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and learn more about the kinds of plans that will be here for you now -- and down the road. i have a lifetime of experience. so i know how important that is. jenna: well, right now a look at what we're bringing you just ahead, new concerns as iran's negotiations in geneva right now. also when president george w. bush was treated for a blocked artery, it was thought to be a routine procedure, and now we're learning more about the former president's heart condition. dr. segal will be here on that. and a woman escapes serious harm after getting hit by two trains, but she didn't escape from the law. those stories ahead. jon: well, the obamacare web site is still seeing glitches three weeks after its launch, many people trying to log on to healthcare.gov hoping to see the smiling faces you see there on that welcome screen are instead being greeted by error messages

and the resulting frustration. so will the series problems get fixed finish serious problems get fixed x how much is it costing us? peter doocy with more on that. >> reporter: here's the problem experts have with healthcare.gov, there's to way for consumers to browse their options or shop anonymously the way they can on private insurance web sites because to do anything on healthcare.gov, users first must create an account, and that's what adopters say is causing a -- developers say is causing the bottleneck. it asks the system to do a lot, and this system apparently can't handle all that work up front. and now officials out in california are calling this, quote, a major design flaw, especially since they reportedly told the feds that the conclusion of a $3 million project hhs ordered that anonymous shopping was a must to avoid this kind of problem. but a brand new report in "forbes" explains that the health and human services department doesn't want consumers to freely browse

because they fear folks will be scared off by unexpectedly high premiums, and "the wall street journal" explains the fed's thought process like this, quote: an hhs spokeswoman said the agency wants to insure that users were aware of their eligibility for subsidies that could help pay for coverage before they started seeing the prices of policies. still, the federal government will not tell us how many people have actually enrolled on their federal exchange at healthcare.gov. that serves 36 states. the latest state numbers we have come from connect for health colorado which reports only 226 people there enrolled during week one for a grand total of 305 people now with new coverage. robert gibbs, who was press secretary at the white house when the affordable care act became law, is publicly blaming web site architecture for many of the problems with healthcare.gov, and he said on another network that all the problems with the site are,

quote, excruciatingly embarrassing for the white house. jon? jon: yeah. a little disturbing that the folks who can't get a web site designed want to get involved in gallbladder surgery and the like. peter doocy, thank you. jenna: negotiations continue over iran's nuclear program today after starting off on what some describe as a bad foot, members of the u.n. security council meeting with iranian officials in geneva right now, and started, tehran backtracked on promises made to remove nuclear material from their country. i'll pick that back up in a second. here is nancy pelosi talk talking a little bit about what we're hearing from some sort of a deal. >> from what we have heard from their negotiations, they are near a final version, and from what we have heard, it sounds pretty positive. of course, i would like a longer lifting of the debt ceiling, but nonetheless, this is great progress. that progress evidently has struck fear in the hearts of the house republicans whose reckless

radical behavior has called upon them to sabotage the bipartisan effort in the united states senate. this is day 15 of the shutdown which has hit our country hard and harder by the day. now, for reasons that i don't quite understand, the republicans want to -- in the house of representatives, again, want to sabotage the bipartisan effort in the senate, and that will hit our economy hard, our global standing as well. but what is also interesting is how it hits the american people in their pocketbooks. it's going to mean higher interest rates on student loans, car payments, mortgages, business loans if you happen to be a small business person. it's going to affect your 401(k). and why? and why? it's hard to understand, because this is very, very damaging. what you saw here earlier right

here where they were, the speaker was here? >> yes. >> was a speaker who did not have the votes for his proposal. if there's any hope here, it's that they don't have the vote. so why are they doing this to the american people? sabotaging a good faith, bipartisan effort coming out of the senate, wasting the public's time? and in this case, time is money. time is money. this is going to be very costly to our economy even if eventually we do lift the debt ceiling, the cost in interest payments will be in the billions of dollars. this republican sabotaging of any effort to move forward is a luxury our country cannot afford. a country -- and you could see by their comments they did not have the votes. there are those on the radical right who don't want to lift the debt ceiling, and you have the

moderates who say they want to do so in a way that is clean, that will go to the senate, that will pass and that the president will sign. with that, i'm pleased to yield to our distinguished mr. hoyer. >> i don't know there's much to add. i think the american people were heartened by the fact that -- jon: as we listen to the house members from the democratic side talking about the negotiations underway, let's go over to the senate where majority leader harry reid is speaking now. >> somehow comes january 15th everything will be hunky dory. there's still processes we have to follow. they set no pattern, no schedule, no routine to do that. for weeks republicans have claimed they want to negotiate. but their legislation completely ignores the need to work with together to craft a budget and put our country on a fiscally-sustainable path. for years, mr. president, taye

taye -- they've complained about why don't we have regular order here, they've complained about lack of a budget. now they don't want us to negotiate a budget. hard to comprehend this logically. but, mr. president, the tea party-driven part of the republican party doesn't follow logic. or why would they want to close the government for 15 days, have us default on our debt? introduction to this measure by the house republican leadership is unproductive and a waste of time. let's be clear, the house legislation will not pass the senate, and here is what the white house said just a few minutes ago. quote: the president has said repeatedly that members of congress don't get to demand ransom for filling their basic responsibilities to pass a budget and pay the nation's bills. unfortunately, the latest plan

from the house republicans does just that in a partisan attempt to appease a small group of tea party republicans who forced the government to shut down in the first place. i am very disappointed with john boehner who would once again try to preserve his role at the expense of the country. i've worked hard to rise above partisanship, find common ground in the senate. and, mr. president, we've done that together for the good of the nation. this is much bigger than the senator who's presiding from the state of hawaii or the assistant leader who's to my side. this is much bigger than that. it's much bigger than me. it's much bigger than two senators who are here from connecticut.

senator from -- we have a senator who's chairman of the budget committee, senator murray. it's bigger than her. it's bigger than the senior senator from new york, senator schumer, who's on this floor. mr. president, we have to start working together for our country. that's what we've been trying to do. this is so disappointing. on the eve of financial destruction for this great country, and that's what it is, to appease a small group of people over there, i'm so disappointed. >> would the senator yield for a question? >> i would be happy to. >> i'd like to ask the senator, majority leader through the chair, one of the key elements in this new proposal from speaker boehner is to diminish this president's authority to deal with a default on our national debt. this authority, so-called extraordinary measures or emergency measures, gives to

presidents going back to president kennedy the wherewithal through the treasury department to try to avoid an economic disaster which could impact families, businesses, jobs and the reputation of the united states in the world. i ask through the chair of the majority leader now that we have seen the republican party bring us so close to the precipice on a default, it is unimaginable to me that any president, including president obama, would surrender this authority to keep america safe in light of this type of threat. is this one of the key elements in terms of the problems associated with the boehner proposal? >> mr. president, to my friend from illinois, the senior senator, we have seen what's gone on these last few months, this whole year with a group of

people who are out giving press conferences, holding demonstrations. they want the government to stay closed. they wanted it closed in the first place. the hardship we have all over this country is really, really awful. and then if that's not good enough, they're out boasting that they want the country to fail its obligations to pay its bills. these are not new programs. these are obligations we have. and then, i mean, that's one of the things. the proposal they have would not allow, for example, my friend is the chair of the most, some say the most important part of the whole federal government to protect the safety and security of the united states, the subcommittee dealing with defense. that was led by many, many

decades by the late senator dan inouye. jon: you know the old saying goes that men should not witness how laws or sausages are made, and there you have some sausage making going on in the senate. both sides, the house, the senate, the democrats, the republicans, they're all trying to put only pressure on each other to get the best deal possible out of this argument over the government shutdown and the impending hitting of the debt ceiling. harry reid there saying he is deeply disappointed in house speaker john boehner for torpedoing, he feels, legislation that reid has put together along with his minority leader complement in the senate, mitch mcconnell. we will continue to watch all the back and forth, all of the arguing and, of course, the question is will the white house sign anything that comes out of this whole process? but they appear to be working toward a deal. can they get there? who knows. we'll keep an eye on it and have

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jenna: news as it comes in to the, and there's a lot of breaking news at the moment. we have the house democratic leadership speaking in washington, d.c., we have, also, democratic senators speaking on the senate floor. they are responding to what has been, what has been reported as a new proposal by speaker john boehner. now, we heard from speaker boehner top of the hour. he did not come out and go through point by point his new proposal that he might bring up in the house, bret baier is with us as we continue to work through this, and we just heard from speaker boehner, but about two hours ago is when the details came out about what he might be thinking about in the house. it certainly has gotten a big reaction from the democrats. why? >> yeah. let's start with what house speaker boehner is saying is inside the plan in his caucus to put a bill forward.

of he's saying they'll go with continuing, the continuing resolution, funding the government through january 15th. they'll raise the debt ceiling til february 7th. there will be a house and senate budget committee conference that works on the house budget and the senate budget to try to come together by december 15th. in addition to that, they're adding on a delay of the medical device tax, also taking away the subsidies for congress members and administration officials tied to obamacare -- not congressional staff -- and then he wants to take away the emergency moving around of money by the treasury secretary as part of this land as well. the pushback from -- well, first of all, let's point out that we don't know yet, and speaker boehner doesn't know whether he can get this plan through the house. from what we've heard, there was a lot of consternation in the house meeting and that there may be, there may not be enough

votes to get that through. and they are not, jenna, going to put a bill on the house floor that fails. because they have images of t.a.r.p., when that bill went to the house floor and failed, and the market crashed about 800 points in one day. the house is very wary of that. they know it x they're not going to -- and they're not going to put a bill on the floor that fails. now, the pushback from the senate is they've been working with mitch mcconnell, the house -- the senate majority leader, harry reid, has had this deal. and a lot of that deal deals with just clean raising the debt ceiling and continuing to fund the government and dealing with everything in this budget conference committee which would have to come to a conclusion by december 15th. jenna: bret, we're going to take a breather there. nancy pelosi's still talking, she was the one that called speaker boehner's plan reckless,

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jenna: back to capitol hill now where democratic house and senate leaders continue to speak in response to a report of a new proposal coming from speaker boehner to potentially put on the floor today, we don't really know the timing on that and, quite frankly are, we don't really know about the votes. bret baier is back with us, and something that nancy pelosi said at the beginning of her talk at the microphone, she said what we witnessed in watching speaker boehner is a speaker who doesn't have the votes. what is your sense from republicans about the new

proposal that has been floated out will by the speaker? >> yeah. and there is some consternation. we've reported and our producer up there says he's heard that inside that caucus meeting there was a lot of back and forth, a lot of questions, a lot of angry tones, if you will, about the proposal. now, here's the deal, jenna, is that we are looking at thursday, okay? as the deadline that the treasury secretary said he can no longer move the money around, the accounting gimmicks that have gotten them to this point. the real, real deadline is november 1st because that's when all the bills are due, and it would only be paid for with tax revenue, and we've talked about this before, but it's a cash flow issue for the u.s. government, and they could possibly miss a payment. you have in this environment the ratings agencies saying that they could downgrade the u.s. and you have china and others saying we need to take another look at america as a finance capital. jenna: and, bret, not to interrupt you, i just wanted to

mention this one highlight that reid apparently just said on the floor that the rating agencies are talking about downgrading us as early as tonight. i want to use some caution with that, but our viewers might see that headline because of the reaction the markets had after that happened in previous years. so that's a scary thought. we don't have anything to back with it up from the rating agencies, we just wanted to mention it. >> yeah. and the s&p has, apparently, put something out about a possible downgrade. but my point in this environment is you're dealing with time. you're dealing with minutes and hours as we come up to thursday. well, if the senate goes forward, they have a whole bunch of archaic rules that they have to get through cloture numerous times. it would take them probably eight days to get something if they follow all the rules exactly, and there's no unanimous consent along the way, it could take eight days to get something through. now, if the house has the votes for what speaker boehner is talking about, they could pass it, send it to the senate, and

the senate could approve it. the meeting that the house could jam the senate with whatever the house comes up with. jenna: we're going to run out of time, bret. we'll be right back top of the hour, more "happening now."

jon: the political battling goes on. john mccain just appeared on the senate floor to say that he defends the republican proposal in the house that is coming forward to try to match up with what the senate has done. john mccain, as you know, has been critical of republicans in the house but whatever they have come up with this morning, he seems to like. let's listen in for just a moment now to senator marco rubio of florida. >> -- to reserve my comments on the issue of iran but i felt that this point reaching today, i could no longer wait to speak out on it so my colleagues here

would indulge me for a few moments, i wanted to talk about it. with regards to our budget and the debt limiting and spending, obamacare, we have another crisis looming, one that goes to national security interest, one that unites us. jon: it appears that marco rubio is going to talk about the situation with regard to iran. while that is serious, we're focussing right now on the budget battles that have the government partially shut down and the nation bumping up against a possible debt controlling in a couple of days. so we're going to move away from that. if there are more remarks in the senate about some kind of a deal that could get the government reopen, we'll certainly bring you back there live. jenna: all right. i guess i'm going to start things off. sorry, everybody. this is a little bit uncrypted here because we're trying to work with some of the breaking news. as we work through it and go back to the capitol hill and the like, we'll stay on top of things. there are duelling plans to end

the government shutdown with the u.s. barrelling toward the first ever default, the white house is weighing in as the president gears up for a key meeting in a few hours. we expect that meeting around 3. 156789 -- 3:15 or so. with the debt ceiling two days away, hours after senate leaders hammered out the framework for a possible deal, that would reopen the government through january 15 and raise the borrowing limit until february. the house g.o.p. floating its own plan that essentially does that, too, but it also does include obamacare. suspending a new tax on medical devices while it takes away the federal government's contributions to lawmakers' health care. take a listen. >> we wanted the democrats to sit down and talk to us so we could work out our differences and we've been saying since day one that we believe there should be no special treatment under the law. jenna: white house called the g.o.p. plan a partisan attempt

to appease the tea party republicans. nancy pelosi weighed in a short time ago. >> that progress, evidently, has struck here in the hearts of the house republicans whose wreckless, radical behavior has called upon them to sabotage the bipartisan effort in the united states senate. jenna: this all happened, raem, within the last three hours. it's nice to take a breath with our chief white house correspondent ed henry who is live with the story and brings us up to date. >> good to talk to you. look. 24 hours ago we were talking about how there was going to be a meeting here at the white house between the president and bipartisan leaders in the house and senate and instead, the meeting you're talking about at 3:15 eastern time today is actually just going to be the president and house democratic leaders so not both chambers and not both parties. the reason why yesterday's meeting was delayed, we were told, is because they were making so much progress in the senate that the president didn't want to sort of get in the way of that. now what are we to read of the

so-called progress? maybe it's going backwards overnight because you say the last three hours, both parties seem to be coming apart again. the white house is now released a photo of the president and vice president meeting yesterday in the rose garden so they're still huddling over here. that may be a response in part to the fact that there have been reports that vice president biden has been sidelined in the talks and you'll remember previous times, for example, in december, it was the vice president working with mitch mc connell that sort of pulled everyone back from the brink. with him reentering the talk, maybe that is a positive sign but as you said, the plan put on the table by house republicans this morning is really angering senate democrats. take a listen to speaker boehner and senator reid. >> our leadership team met with our members today trying to find a way forward in a bipartisan way that would continue to provide fairness to the american people under obamacare. there are a lot of opinions about what direction to go.

there have been no decisions about what exactly we will do. >> we felt blind sided by news from the house. but this isn't the first time. extremist republicans in the house of representatives are attempting to torpedo the bipartisan progress with a bill that can't pass the senate, can't pass the senate and won't pass the senate. >> so why is senator reid reacting so negatively? because the house republican plan would get the government back open through january 15, would extend the debt limit through february 7. those are things the president wants, that's something that senate democrats want and senate republicans have said they wanted but house republicans are now adding other things, sort of including a two-year delay of the medical device tax, bringing changes to health care that the senate leaders, at least yesterday, had a degreed to delay until december in broader budget talks. want white house put out this statement saying the president has said repeatedly that members of congress don't get to demand

ransom for filling their basic responsibilities to pass a budget and pay the nation's bills. unfortunately the latest prop e proposal from house republicans does just that to appease a small group of tea party republicans who forced the government shutdown in the first place. the bottom line is everybody yesterday, last night was talking about how we're closing in on a deal. now it appears we're pulling ever so slightly back from a deal. jenna: and 3:15, ed, a meeting today? the president has scheduled suddenly? >> yeah. and look. they say at the white house that any time the president could add a bipartisan meeting, bring over mitch mcconnell and speaker boehner but the signal we're getting it's house democrats right now, they don't want to push it over the top. jenna: in addition to the agenda we saw within the last hour or so, thanks. jon: for more on the politics of

the shutdown, the 15-day-old stale mate, jerry writing in his weekly column in the "wall street journal," at this point he writes, it is both an understatement and a statement of the obvious to say the government shutdown showdown hasn't been good for the republican party. and jerry joins us now. what about these latest developments? it appears speaker boehner is not confident that he has the votes to even deliver what is being discussed right now and obviously he's getting hammered by both the white house and the senate. where are we going with this? >> i think you've described it correctly and it's not an unfamiliar position for speaker boehner. i think you're right. he tried to put up house today alternative to what the senate is doing. its basic objective was to put more of the rollback of obamacare onto a house version of the bill that would reopen the government and raise the debt ceiling. i think he probably found conservatives weren't ready to

go along with that. he may be ready to give them more. i think the reaction from the white house and senator reid was designed to say, look. we think the action is in the senate. that's where the solution is going to submerge. what's happening in the house is getting in the way of what we think is a process that's going to produce something that will ultimately even pass the house. i believe the reaction was as intense as the clips you just showed indicated. jon: you hosted a breakfast with leon panetta, well respected man in washington. he said both sides here bear the blame. he's not one of those people saying it's all the fault of extremist republicans. >> it was an interesting conversation. leon panetta was the white house chief of staff last time there was a government shutdown in 1995, and 1996. he's seen had movie before.

his message was that you only deal with these problems by engaging and he used the word en engagement 20 times. these things don't solve themselves. they get solved when people engage on all sides and to the republicans, he said, look. you can't say we need to have a big, brought budget conversation and say you can't bring tax revenues onto the table to at least discuss and to the white house he was saying, you don't get the luxury in this town just because it hasn't worked out well before where we try negotiations of walking away from the table. that's where you resolve these things. what he's looking for is a return to kind of regular order, the process in which people in congress whose job it is to write a budget get together in a conference room and do that job without all of these outside special panels or the static from the conversation outside that room. jon: all right. it's going to be a fascinating day. >> maybe not a fun one but fascinating. absolutely. jon: we'll let you get back to

watching the politics. >> thanks. jenna: fascinating. jon: fascinating. jenna: there's also a big question what this means for the economy. what does it mean for the markets? what does it mean for your money? these are big questions and senator reid just made a comment about the economy, about our status in the worldwide economy moments ago. let's take a listen. >> the debt is here. the deadline is looming. agencies are talking about downgrading us as early as tonight. jenna: our friends at fox business have tried to confirm that. are the rating agencies indicating that that could happen overnight? and according to some sources few fbn, these agencies don't comment on market speculation. agencies, we're using that term freely, these are really companies and their job is to

rate the credit worthiness of different companies and different countries and i just showed you what's happening on wall street. despite all this upheaval, the stock market is not reacting very much but it could change if we heard something from the rating agencies and we'll pay close attention to that but so far, nothing to substantiate what harry reid is saying. maybe it's something he heard. we'll see if that happens tonight or otherwise. jon: he's had some sources before on things that turned out to be a little bit suspect so we'll see how that goes. there's much more on the breaking news from capitol hill. in the mean time, immigration reform supporters going to extremes to help illegals stay in the country. how they're trying to disrupt deportations and why they say they want president obama to get involved.

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jenna: breaking headline out of san diego. do you remember former mayor filner of san diego? he had to resign because of accusations of sexual harassment against him. he will appear in a san diego courtroom at 1:00 p.m. eastern time. the california attorney general's office will release details on the case at this time but what the associated press is reporting, among others, he's facing felony false imprisonment and two misdemeanor counts of battery. the criminal case named three jane does as victims. jon: activists are demanding the government stop deporting illegal immigrants. now they're using new tactics like chaining themselves to buses and surrounding border patrol units. there are details what they're up to live in los angeles.

>> recall the controversy where the president, without congressional approval, said police could not deport illegal immigrants who arrived here as children? advocates say no one should be deported and they're changing themselves to buses and federal buildings to convince lawmakers to allow them to state. in phoenix, 250 protestors wanted to stop deportation. they want to legalize everyone here illegally but since that's bottled up in congress, they want the president to act through executive order. no >> no one sees what happens once folks are picked up and once families are separated. for us it happens every day and it's our mission to keep the pressure because we're already at too many deportations and how long -- how many people are going to have this happen? >> to make their point, friday in tucson, protestors chained

themselves to buses. days earlier, police pepper sprayed a crowd trying to stop border agents from taking custody of two illegals during a traffic stop. opponents say these actions, ignoring the rule of law, risks alienating potential supporters. >> i say it isn't enough. deport them all. they came here illegally. they knew when they came here we have laws and laws have consequences. >> the president said he does not favor so-called blanket amnesty but has instructed agencies not to break up families so no surprise, border patrol sources now tell me they see entire families, not just young men, crossing the border. back to you. jon: what a controversy. thanks. now nine families in pennsylvania can only wait and worry as the earth threatens to swallow everything they own.

four sink holes suddenly appeared. experts have been hard at work but they say repairs will not begin until later this week at the earliest. the families are staying at nearby hotels right now. they say recent road construction left the area with poor drainage. that let the water accumulate underground and then came the sink holes. jenna: we can understand why they're worried when you see the pictures. moments ago senator marco rubio stepped to the senate floor in the middle of all of this talk about what's happening with the government shutdown and the debt ceiling. he wanted to talk about iran and the reason did he that is because there's big talks happening right now between our country, iran and a few others overseas. that's next. also we'll go in depth on a murder mystery. utah man accused of killing his beauty queen wife with a cocktail of prescription drugs. we'll catch you up on that and tell you the details of the case next.

jenna: nuclear talks with iran and six world powers underway right now at iran's deputy foreign minister. they said it's too early to say if any progress has been made. our next guest said it's hard to tie iran at its word. mark, great to have you a lot of news is happening today so we appreciate you rolling with us as well. we talked a lot about talks and negotiations with iran. this time seems to be different. what are the stakes of these talks today? >> the stakes are that iran is moving forward aggressively with the nuclear program.

it's eight months away from having an up -- undetectable breakout. we have eight months to continue to negotiate with iran and at the same time, understand these are masters of nuclear deception and they're trying to prolong talks to get to a nuclear bomb. jenna: one piece you talked about is to make sure we keep the sanctions on and keep the pressure on. there's a little bit of a tie-in to the government shutdown. marco rubio was just talking on the senate floor. he says we need to do that as well. but there's another round of sanctions that are stuck in the senate, aren't there? tell us about that and how important those are to the talks that are also happening right now. >> right. the real question is whether iran run out of money before or after the united states runs out of money? it's absolutely critical that we get our government back working and our folks working on this

issue. the bill is stuck in the senate and that's because the administration has indicated to senate deps they don't want to move the bill while we are negotiating with iran. now, clearly it's only sanctions that have brought the iranians to the table and it's only massively enhanced sanction that will give us the negotiating leverage we need to conclude a peaceful nuclear deal. i think the folks on the hill, the perception is this bill needs to move and move aggressively and move quickly for the iranians to take notice. jenna: that's what senator rubio says as well. others agree with the administration that welcome off a bit and maybe talk more. one thing you mention in the article is abandoning the nuclear program for iran would be a huge humiliation for the ruling class. you want to make your adversary look good to whoever they're serving. how can we make sure iran stays safe but also abandons the nuclear program which is our end goal? >> i think the issue of saving face has really been overstated.

this is a regime, the supreme leader, the president, the revolutionary guards have been committed for 30 years to building a nuclear weapon. the only thing that's going to crack their nuclear will is if they put their fundamental choice between a nuclear bomb and the survival of their regime. economic sanctions that cause economic collapse are what's going to give us the negotiating leverage to complete a deal. iran can have a civilian nuclear energy program and buy nuclear fuel from abroad like 19 other countries but it cannot be in contra ventrion and it has to stop the nuclear enriching. jenna: it's an important story we don't want to forget even a -- on a day like today. jon: you probably have heard of this guy. he's the accused facebook killer. florida man who allegedly shot

his wife, then posted the pibt of her dead body on a facebook page. today he faces the judge. plus court action in another high profile murder case. this one involving the former new england patriot aaron hernandez. we're live with an update on his case.

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jenna: welcome back. the florida man who allegedly confessed to killing his wife on facebook is appearing in court today. his name is derrick medinas and

he's accused of shooting his wife to death after an argument in august and posting a picture of her dead body online. here is more on had this story. >> it's a bizarre one. derrick tells police he was essentially forced to empty his magazine in his pistol into his wife's body in the kitchen in august to save himself. as 31-year-old derek medina walked into the courtroom, he looked skinnier, both hands and feet shackled and he's not shaven in eight weeks he's been held in custody. his attorney complaining to the judge that because of budget cuts, the jail has refused to provide a razor because they wanted to clean him up for today's hearing. inside the miami courtroom right now, bond hearing is about 60 minutes underway so far. the prosecutors have called two witnesses to the stand. both of whom are police officers

who went on the stand telling the judge during their initial interrogation with medina on the night he killed his wife, he confessed in this video tape. >> why did you do that? >> cuz it was self defense and i'm very -- i honored my country. i honored my state and city of south miami and i did not feel that i'm guilty. i do not feel like i intently killed. i do not feel like this was, you know, like i was out there to kill her, no. i wasn't. this was self defense. >> surprising, just about everyone who heard about this explanation the past few days, medina justified him posting the photo of his freshly killed wife's body on hers and his facebook pages because in a twisted act of compassion, he wanted her parents to see their

daughter was dead so they called police and then go over to retrieve her 10-year-old daughter who had been hiding upstairs in their home throughout the entire argument as well as the gunshots. inside the courtroom, a large contingent of jennifer's family is there, her stepfather, her mother as well as her biological father. on the other side there seems to be a couple of supporters of derek medina as well. we're waiting to see in this multiple hour bond hearing today whether any of these family members are going to take the stand and offer some emotional testimony. the judge is allowing witness testimony. this is something that the prosecutors do not want. they do not want medina released on bond. he's currently charged with second degree murder and this could go on throughout much of the afternoon. more later. jenna: we'll watch for that. thank you. jon: there's also court action linked to the high profile murder case against former new england patriot aaron hernandez.

his fiance faces arraignment two hours from now on perjury issues. at issue, testimony she gave to a grand jury. we're keeping an eye on these developments. molly? >> the defense attorneys for aaron hernandez say that the woman who is his fiance, this woman identified his jenkins will be charged with perjury charges. the investigation of the murder of 27-year-old oden lloyd, a boston man that investigators say was killed by hernandez in june. jenkins, who has a young daughter with her unanimoused he is and lived with him in his north mini mansion will face a judge at about 2:00 today. we have very little information regarding what happened in the grand jury proceedings because they are considered to be secret. they're secret by nature but there are many court documents that offer some insight into jenkins' involvement in the case.

investigators believe she's withheld information. she was talking with police, sharing information about the security system at the home, the fact her sister was dating lloyd and also where hernandez was in the weekend running up to the actual murder but all that stopped when she received a call from hernandez. surveillance video from hernandez's home the day following the murder shows jenkins carrying something resembling a cover of a safe or lock box to a vehicle. she left in a car and in 35 minutes she returned later and that object was gone. one of the documents we obtained revealed that jenkins, along with other parties that investigators believe are involved in the case, have, quote, all made overt attempts to hide evidence, render assistance for the suspect to allude law enforcement and hinder and mislead in this investigation. if convicted, jenkins faces not more than 20 years in state prison. jon: thanks, molly.

jenna: right now the trial beginning for a utah doctor accused of killing his wife. a former beauty queen with a deadly cocktail of prescription drugs. that's what was used apparently in this alleged murder. here is more from the breaking news desk. >> prosecutors say dr. martin mc neil gave his wife a fatal drug cocktail so he could continue an affair and today jury selection begins in his first degree murder charge in utah. in 2007 the couple's 6-year-old daughter found michelle mc neil's fully clothed body in a bathtub. the doctor told his wife to get a face lift and then gave her pills for her recovery. since then, he and the woman have both served prison time for fraud. michelle was a former beauty queen in and a devoted mother of eight children, according to relatives. at least two of the daughters

plan to testify against their father at trial. dr. mc neil has also pleaded guilty to lying to investigators and in a separate case, still pending, the former mormon sunday school teacher is charged with felony forcible sexual abuse. opening arguments and testimony are expected to begin thursday. jenna: thank you. jon: this is a very strange case. let's talk about it with our legal panel. joining us is lis wiehl and esther on the right of the scene there, a criminal defense attorney. the medical examiner did not even list a cause of death, doesn't call this a homicide. so how do you charge a guy with murder when the medical examiner doesn't say it was a murder? >> i don't know. and that's -- this is the perfect definition of a case with reasonable doubt. if you can't even get the expert to work for the state to say how she sdieed, how do you expect a jury to override the medical examiner and say it was a homicide and not just it was a

homicide but this man is the one who did it. there's so much speculation that's involved from getting -- from a charge in this case to a conviction that it's unbelievable. they're only going after him because of his bad character. jon: do you see it the same way? >> i don't. yes, it's a hurdle for the prosecution but there are lots of cases where the prosecution hasn't had a body and you still go ahead with the murder charge and leave it up to the jury. the medical examiner didn't quite say that. the second time around, he had to look at the body, you know, looked at it again, medical examiner said it could have been drugs that went into a heart and created a cardiac arrest and that's how she died. well, how did she get the drugs? she got the drugs when her husband took her to the drug. she didn't even want it. her kids will testify to that. he took her to the doctor. after four or five really toxic drugs and he was the one giving her the drugs. he's a doctor himself. she had bandages over her face. she couldn't tell even what she was having, what she was getting

from it. jon: he was apparently giving her the drugs. go ahead. >> this is many days after the surgery. this wasn't a couple of days after the surgery where she was still bandaged. she was getting around, ambulato ambulatory. she was moving. there's no time line, a window of opportunity where they're going to be able to say for temperature that dr. mc neil had the opportunity to give her the drugs before she died. >> i was in the home with her and that's what it took, a while. it was a slow, lethal dose. why? the doctor knew it was going to show up in her autopsy and he wanted to make sure it went very, very slow. by the way, two other daughters are going to be testifying against him. that tells you something. they wanted this case reopened. the mistress is going to testify and one of those fraud things he was convicted of, they got a fraudulent marriage certificate on the day of her death, on the day of this woman's death. come on. jon: let me ask you something else. >> that's bad character.

that's not murder. jon: let me ask you about something else one of the daughters said. it was in a pretrial hearing. she testified she was helping her mother wash her hair just a couple of days, i believe, before the murder and her mother supposedly said to her, i was helping her -- i'm sorry. the mother said alex, if anything happens to me, make sure it was not your father. the jury is not going to hear that. why? >> well, you know what? you're right. they won't hear that because that's hearsay but she's not available so it's possible you could get a hearsay acceptance so that could come in. >> it's not coming in because it's -- jon: we'll keep watching this case in utah. fascinating murder case about to get underway. thank you both. jenna: an american hero is about to receive the highest medal america can bestow. a father watched his 13-year-old

daughter to do homework every night. he tried to do it with her. have you tried that? jon: my kids' homework is way too advanced. jenna: power panel joind us whether we're swamping our kids with too much homework next. you should take advil. why? you can take four advil for all day relief. so i should give up my two aleve for more pills with advil? you're joking right? for my back pain, i want my aleve.

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>> also a story not getting a lot of attention. two young girls will be charged by prosecutors in connection with the suicide of one of their friends. another one of these bullying cases that every parent and frankly, everyone needs to hear. we'll have that for you. how is the coffee, kids? >> it's delicious. we're ready to go at the top of the hour. see you then. jenna: taking a break from politics for this question. how much homework is too much homework? in a very funny testimony in the atlantic monthly, a father

attempts to do his 13-year-old's homework. the title of the piece says it all. my daughter's homework is killing me. after being swamped with hours of homework a night, the author, writes this. quote, are these many hours of homework the only way to achieve this met morph sis of my child? certainly they've told me all the homework does no harm. as i watch my daughter struggle through school days on too many sleep and feel almost guilty if she wants to watch an hour of television, i have my doubts. that said, american kids ranked significantly lower in global standards than other developed countries. coming in 17th in reading out of 65 and 20th in math. so what's the right call here? not enough homework? too much homework? what's best for our kids? we have a fox news contributor

and teacher. great to have you both. it's an interesting topic. i'm sure we have our own experiences with homework and whether or not we did it. let me talk to you first. the author of this piece denies teachers and administrators. he said they're trying to do their job and cover the curriculum that the district or the school says a fourth or fifth or sixth grader should accomplish. that's your take on this having worked in schools and seeing different styles of teaching? >> i think teachers do feel a lot of pressure and a lot of times it's not their fault. they feel like they have to cover a certain number of things so they dish out a lot of homework. what they need to do is focus on quality and not quantity. what they learn to do is to memorize and to regurgitate information. what they don't learn to do is problem solve. what winds up happening is if you shift the question a little bit, or change the scenario a little bit, the kids are lost. you really need to get them to

think and teach them how to think and not necessarily clock in hours but follow what methods will best get them to step outside the box and use their mind. that's why kids often have a lot of trouble on analytical exams or g.r.e.'s or s.a.t.'s because they're coming at questions from an angle that kids aren't used to. they're used to repetitive kinds of questions. it will take teachers being willing to step outside the box to get kids to step outside their minds as well. jenna: is that the experience of your fourth grader, he's more into the memorization part? >> very, very much so. my fourth grader, i have a real hard time with him in the evening getting him to sit down and do his homework and not just write it down. he needs to really understand it. he needs to think through it and sometimes i just want him to understand that it's not ju the right answer or wrong answer. we need to get through it to figure out how you got to that answer and show that on paper. jenna: how many hours of

homework does your fourth grader have? >> two or 2 1/2 hours of homework. jenna: do you find you're also doing the homework with him? is he getting a lot of benefit out that far time? >> i find the two of us are sitting there doing homework and sometimes we have to wait for my husband to come home and help with some of the math homework that i actually can't even do myself. so i think that it is a constant struggle because they are -- they need to be in school, need to be learning what they're learning in school and then come home and they have all of this additional work plus they have after school. there's just a lot of pressure on these kids and i feel like sometimes during the day, at school they should be doing some of this work or more of this work so they don't have to bring it home in the evening and when they're exhausted and overwhelmed. jenna: where do you draw the line here, though? there is something to be said for the ability to memorize and there's something to be said for the discipline of sitting down for a couple of hours and doing homework at really any age. how do we navigate that part of

it as well? you certainly want the kids to be disciplined so they're successful but you don't want to yooefr -- overwhelm them. >> i taught spanish. there's a place for that. but not at the expense of understanding what you're actually doing and what's really interesting about the guy that wrote the article i atlantic and tried to do his kid's homework, he realizes he's pressured for time and he starts repeating stuff that he's not processing. i've tut arored kids for a long time and as an adult, what i try to do is get kids to sit and think about what they're doing and they panic and say to me, but i don't have time for this. i don't have time to understand. and that's why our kids are lagging behind. they're not really taking the time to understand what's happening. and i think also there needs to be a role for them to do outside activities, to take a creative writing class, take an art class. that's how they figure out what they love and what they're passionate about and what they're going to do one day with their lives. you have to have space for that. jenna: it's interesting in the

piece they talk about the cycle. cycles of a lot of homework, little homework. this author got in trouble with the principal for asking parents about what they thought about the homework. he was accused of cyberbullying. >> not surprising. not surprising. jenna: it's an interesting take. great to have you both. thank you so much. jon: and alleged al qaeda mastermind is now on american soil. the latest as one of america's most wanted terrorists makes his first court appearance in new york city. and from colts favorite to network dominator, amc walking dead. hoards of zombies. how are things with the new guy? all we do is go out to dinner. that's it? i mean, he picks up the tab every time, which is great...what? he's using you. he probably has a citi thankyou card and gets 2x the points at restaurants. so he's just racking up points with me.

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jenna: wow, right? the walking dead, a thriller features hoordz -- hoards of undead. julie joins us with more on today's 411. >> yeah. you're okay after watching this? jenna: the people behind you not doing so well. >> but the ratings sure are. apparently there are a lot of zombie lovers out there. the walking dead captured the biggest audience sunday night with its season four premier just before halloween, captivating an audience of 16.1 million, up more than five million since the october 2012 debut. the show actually beat all broadcast criteria and was up 30% from the season three

finale. if you combine all the broadcast dramas that aired sunday night, including once upon a time, revenge and betrayal, they do not come close to matching the walking dead rating. viewers posted nearly 40,000 tweets in the first minute of the east coast broadcast. so did at least one star of the show. he thanked fans for watching and according according to neilson's social guide, walking dead took the lead followed by glee and then horror story on fx and later was one of my personal favorites, scandal. a lot of people tweeting on that as well. jenna: no zombies. >> no. i'm not really into the gory stuff. jon: the makeup artists are getting a lot of -- >> they did your face today, didn't they, jon? they're very talented. >> i don't look like this at all

in real life. >> that's your before picture. jenna: good point, jon. jon: thank you. more of the fox 411. senate, we're told, is working toward a deal while house republicans push their over plan. all the breaking news from capitol hill, only two days we might mention before a debt ceiling deadline. new york giants fans know they are having a rough season but a well known new yorker says he's bet on congress to get something done before he would bet on the giants? ouch. we'll tell you who said that. when you have diabetes like i do,

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>> a new york senator not showing much love these days. he bet on congress reopening the government before picking the

giants to win. here is chuck shumer talking to tmz. i am hopeful that the government will reopen. i am hoping they will win a week from sunday. >> i love the giants. it pains me not as much as the government shutting down, but it pains me. i stay up and watch everyone of their games and sooner or later we will win one. >> so they are watching football and can't get together. giants are 0- 6. >> broncos are doing okay. we'll take you out toccata lina island marinna. one of the instructors is out snorkeling and seeing an eye looking at her from this

kraepture. it is a orfish. 15 feet long and took 15 adults to pull it out of the water. it is thought to be the reason for sea serpent legends. bill and ally are up next. will democrats in the senate agree to the latest stand off? >> i am alisoy osama bin laden. mike is on capitol hill to sort it out. >> reporter: they will not like the by-product of senate negotiations. house republicans would fund the go